Dinner party rules - Revision history

Vector at 01:15, 29 May 2026

2026-05-29T01:15:43Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:15, 29 May 2026
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	* Every chord must be comprised of a chain of friends in which each note is a friend to every other note		* Every chord must be comprised of a chain of friends in which each note is a friend to every other note
	* No note can have an enemy		* No note can have an enemy
	* No crowding (~~exception made~~ for tension chords)		* No crowding (except for tension chords)

	Once these are taken into consideration, finding usable chords and chord progressions in systems like 24edo is considerably easier.		Once these are taken into consideration, finding usable chords and chord progressions in systems like 24edo is considerably easier.

Kili at 12:59, 27 May 2026

2026-05-27T12:59:40Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:59, 27 May 2026
Line 3:		Line 3:
	* Every chord must be comprised of a chain of friends in which each note is a friend to every other note		* Every chord must be comprised of a chain of friends in which each note is a friend to every other note
	* No note can have an enemy		* No note can have an enemy
	* No crowding (~~except~~ for ~~ension~~ chords)		* No crowding (exception made for tension chords)

	Once these are taken into consideration, finding usable chords and chord progressions in systems like 24edo is considerably easier.		Once these are taken into consideration, finding usable chords and chord progressions in systems like 24edo is considerably easier.

Kili: /* Application Examples */ added oexab.mploe

2026-05-13T17:14:25Z

Application Examples: added oexab.mploe

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:14, 13 May 2026
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	=== [[24edo]] ===		=== [[24edo]] ===
	24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third/paraminor fourth and an inframinor sixth/paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.		24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third/paraminor fourth and an inframinor sixth/paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.

			=== [[159edo]] ===
			For a complete list of Interval Amity and-or Compositional Theory, see [[User:Aura/On 159edo Music Theory (Part 1)\|Aura's 159edo Guides]]
	[[Category:WIP pages]]		[[Category:WIP pages]]

Vector at 19:51, 6 May 2026

2026-05-06T19:51:21Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:51, 6 May 2026
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	Friends and enemies are basically the two ends of a spectrum of compatibility. In higher EDO systems, this spectrum comes noticeably into play, and a numerical compatibility rating along this spectrum is generally going to be helpful. Furthermore, some notes can be called '''frenemies''' since they meet the definition of either an enemy or a friend only part of the time, or else, meet the definitions of both at the same time. In addition, one frequently has to worry about "ratio ambiguity"- that is, notes which can have more than one relationship to each other.		Friends and enemies are basically the two ends of a spectrum of compatibility. In higher EDO systems, this spectrum comes noticeably into play, and a numerical compatibility rating along this spectrum is generally going to be helpful. Furthermore, some notes can be called '''frenemies''' since they meet the definition of either an enemy or a friend only part of the time, or else, meet the definitions of both at the same time. In addition, one frequently has to worry about "ratio ambiguity"- that is, notes which can have more than one relationship to each other.

	The phenomenon of '''crowding''' is a major source of dissonance. Specifically, it results when an interval separating two notes is either too small or too close to an octave-reduplication of the starting note. Perhaps the most common examples of intervals that cause this are 9/8 and 15/8, though intervals such as 17/15 are also known to cause crowding.		The phenomenon of '''crowding''' is a major source of dissonance. Specifically, it results when an interval separating two notes is either too small or too close to an octave-reduplication of the starting note. Perhaps the most common examples of intervals that cause this are 9/8 and 15/8, though intervals such as 17/15 are also known to cause crowding. (However, in some harmonic systems crowding can be seen as characteristic of intervals smaller than ~10/9, with 9/8 notably not crowding.)

	== Application Examples ==		== Application Examples ==

Vector: these are equivalent in 24edo

2026-05-06T19:50:12Z

these are equivalent in 24edo

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:50, 6 May 2026
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	=== [[24edo]] ===		=== [[24edo]] ===
	24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth~~, a paraminor fourth and a~~ paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.		24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third/paraminor fourth and an inframinor sixth/paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.
	[[Category:WIP pages]]		[[Category:WIP pages]]

Kili: /* 24edo */

2026-05-06T18:54:18Z

24edo

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:54, 6 May 2026
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	=== [[24edo]] ===		=== [[24edo]] ===
	~~{\| class="wikitable collapsable collapsed" \|}~~
	24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.		24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.
	[[Category:WIP pages]]		[[Category:WIP pages]]

Kili at 18:53, 6 May 2026

2026-05-06T18:53:31Z

@@ Line 22: / Line 22: @@
 === [[24edo]] ===
 {| class="wikitable collapsable  collapsed" |}
 edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied.  Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth.  Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list.  Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.
 [[Category:WIP pages]]

Kili: trying to actually describ system

2026-05-06T18:53:14Z

trying to actually describ system

@@ Line 22: / Line 22: @@
 === [[24edo]] ===
 edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied.  Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth.  Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list.  Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.
 [[Category:WIP pages]]

Kili at 18:30, 6 May 2026

2026-05-06T18:30:20Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:30, 6 May 2026
Line 23:		Line 23:
	=== [[24edo]] ===		=== [[24edo]] ===
	24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.		24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.
			[[Category:WIP pages]]

Kili: dinner party ruleoas. i essentially copied and pasted this from the xenwiki, but i think it would be better to make the page distinct.

2026-05-06T18:22:52Z

dinner party ruleoas. i essentially copied and pasted this from the xenwiki, but i think it would be better to make the page distinct.

New page

First compiled by "Quartertone Harmony", a YouTuber who had been exploring and experimenting with [[24edo]] for some time, the '''Dinner Party Rules''' are a set of rules which aim to simplify expansion of 12edo harmony into 24edo. The three rules are as follows:

* Every chord must be comprised of a chain of friends in which each note is a friend to every other note
* No note can have an enemy
* No crowding (except for ension chords)

Once these are taken into consideration, finding usable chords and chord progressions in systems like 24edo is considerably easier.

== Terms ==
Each rule contains terms that require explanation, especially for purposes of generalizing these rules to other [[EDO]]<nowiki/>s.

A '''friend''' here is defined as a note separated from the starting note by either a close approximation of an LCJI interval, or else, a close approximation of a delta-rational interval, without being too close to one another in acoustic proximity. Friends are most frequently prefect consonances such as 3/2 or 4/3, imperfect consonances such as 5/4 or 8/5, or ambisonances such as 7/4 or 8/7. However, sometimes imperfect dissonances also meet the definition of a friend, for example, a neutral third like 11/9.

An '''enemy''' is defined here as a note separated from the starting note by an interval that causes intense discordance, or else, does not easily connect the two notes through LCJI or through delta-rational relationships. Perfect dissonances are always enemies in some capacity or other, while imperfect dissonances are less likely to meet this criterion. Just about the only way to get away with enemies in a chord is to space them really far apart.

Friends and enemies are basically the two ends of a spectrum of compatibility. In higher EDO systems, this spectrum comes noticeably into play, and a numerical compatibility rating along this spectrum is generally going to be helpful. Furthermore, some notes can be called '''frenemies''' since they meet the definition of either an enemy or a friend only part of the time, or else, meet the definitions of both at the same time. In addition, one frequently has to worry about "ratio ambiguity"- that is, notes which can have more than one relationship to each other.

The phenomenon of '''crowding''' is a major source of dissonance. Specifically, it results when an interval separating two notes is either too small or too close to an octave-reduplication of the starting note. Perhaps the most common examples of intervals that cause this are 9/8 and 15/8, though intervals such as 17/15 are also known to cause crowding.

== Application Examples ==
Application of these rules to smaller EDO systems is more likely to be straightforward, however, even larger systems can have these rules applied.

=== [[24edo]] ===
24edo was the first EDO system to which these rules were applied. Examples of friends in this system are a major third, a minor third, a neutral third, an inframinor third, an ultramajor second, and, of course, the perfect fourth and perfect fifth. Examples of enemies are an ultraprime, an inframinor second, an infraoctave, and an ultramajor seventh, and, in the majority of cases, an ultramajor third, an inframinor sixth, a paraminor fourth and a paramajor fifth also make this list. Crowding in this system is caused by intervals smaller than or equal to a major second relative to the unison or octave.